What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Discuss the MVC hoops season here.

What happens next?

Wichita St leaves for a better league
40
37%
Missouri St, IllinoisSt, UNI move up to FBS
27
25%
MVC expands
40
37%
 
Total votes : 107

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby AndShock » September 14th, 2014, 5:47 pm

SWOMO will NEVER average 25k fans per game. SWOMO can only aspire to be half of what Arkansas State is.
AndShock
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 1009
Joined: August 9th, 2010, 7:28 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Sponsor

Sponsor
 

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby mvcfan » September 14th, 2014, 7:00 pm

AndShock wrote:SWOMO will NEVER average 25k fans per game. SWOMO can only aspire to be half of what Arkansas State is.


They got 18000 fans yesterday. Unless they win big, they won't average 18000 fans.
mvcfan
All MVC
All MVC
 
Posts: 634
Joined: July 31st, 2012, 10:57 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby Aargh » September 14th, 2014, 9:19 pm

I had never heard of Arkansas State until the discussion of MSU to the SunBelt came up. Another school I didn't know existed until the current discussion is North Dakota. I suppose I probably knew there was a North Dakota, but I never heard of them.

Right now may be the worst time possible for any FB decisions other than dropping FB. The P5 have the ability to make any other college FB irrelevant, other than to local fans. If a school has enough local fans to support a program in that situation, then that school can continue supporting a FB program.

That school is likely to become irrelevant in all sports because of the financial and human resources that have to be dedicated to an irrelevant FB program.
User avatar
Aargh
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 1924
Joined: August 16th, 2010, 10:08 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby mvcfan » September 14th, 2014, 10:04 pm

Aargh wrote:I had never heard of Arkansas State until the discussion of MSU to the SunBelt came up. Another school I didn't know existed until the current discussion is North Dakota. I suppose I probably knew there was a North Dakota, but I never heard of them.

Right now may be the worst time possible for any FB decisions other than dropping FB. The P5 have the ability to make any other college FB irrelevant, other than to local fans. If a school has enough local fans to support a program in that situation, then that school can continue supporting a FB program.

That school is likely to become irrelevant in all sports because of the financial and human resources that have to be dedicated to an irrelevant FB program.


I think that I heard of ASU when Ron Baker turned down a full scholarship to play basketball there in favor of walking on at Wichita State.
mvcfan
All MVC
All MVC
 
Posts: 634
Joined: July 31st, 2012, 10:57 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby Cdizzle » September 15th, 2014, 9:36 am

I remember when I used to go to football games.

I was in high school. It cost me $7, with student discount.

I am not an economist, but I do often find truth in the saying "you get what you pay for."

Draw your own conclusions.
Cdizzle
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2188
Joined: November 11th, 2010, 11:28 am

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby glm38 » September 15th, 2014, 9:45 am

Aargh wrote:I had never heard of Arkansas State until the discussion of MSU to the SunBelt came up. Another school I didn't know existed until the current discussion is North Dakota. I suppose I probably knew there was a North Dakota, but I never heard of them.

Right now may be the worst time possible for any FB decisions other than dropping FB. The P5 have the ability to make any other college FB irrelevant, other than to local fans. If a school has enough local fans to support a program in that situation, then that school can continue supporting a FB program.

That school is likely to become irrelevant in all sports because of the financial and human resources that have to be dedicated to an irrelevant FB program.


I agree with a lot of what you say. It all depends on what your definition of "irrelevant" is. If being relevant means competing for national titles at the highest level then no both Sunbelt and FCS programs aren't relevant. But if they are supported by the student body and local fans they are very relevant. MSU'S game on Sat was so much fun - try telling those 18000 plus fans that our game on Sat was irrelevant! Events like that unify and energize a community and campus.

PS: at this point we are maxed out at 18000 plus fans. Sat was very close to a sellout. Standing room only was all that was left I believe. So we won't be getting 25000 anytime soon.
User avatar
glm38
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2620
Joined: July 3rd, 2011, 2:00 pm
Location: Springfield, MO

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby Aargh » September 15th, 2014, 11:28 am

Renovated stadium, big promo (including low-dollar tickets), pack the place, win the game.

That's an outstanding formula for building a following. That puts MSU on a good basis for building their program. Stay on that path for a couple of years, including "win the game", and then there is a reason to consider moving to the FBS division. Right now, that discussion seems premature.

There are schools that operate "get by" type programs with attendance that will fit into an 18K stadium. The step up to FBS is huge. It isn't just the scholarships. If you want to compete for the better recruits, everything costs more. Training and conditioning facilities, practice facilities, locker rooms, dorms. The cost of everything goes through the roof. Coaching salaries skyrocket. Without significant TV revenues, you need in the range of 40K - 50K butts in seats averaging around $40 spent per person. That's a pricey stadium, and a huge percentage of the population of your part of the world.

If you are content to be a bottom-dweller in the top division, you can do that on the cheap. I've never heard fans chanting "We're Number (one hundred and) One". Why strive for mediocrity?

My definition of "relevant" is all about TV revenues. You've simply got to have them if you have any intention of competing with the P5 guys.
User avatar
Aargh
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 1924
Joined: August 16th, 2010, 10:08 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby Sir Sci » September 16th, 2014, 12:16 pm

As a Missouri State fan who does not necessarily want the school to move to the Sun Belt for many reasons, I'd just like to say that the purpose of this thread is to discuss potential movement and what will come first.

In reality, I think the Valley stays the same for a decent number of years. However, IF something is going to change, it will be either UNI, MO State, or Ill. St. moving up. While the Shocker fans here may be right that football is just a drain on other sports, the fact remains that it is what drives most conferences.

Without a football team, the only conferences even available to WSU to move to are the A-10 and the Big East. I find the A-10 incredibly unlikely simply because of geography, especially if SLU moves to the Big East someday. Quite simply, a team in Kansas isn't going to be in the Atlantic 10. The Big East is entirely private, and only one is not a Catholic school. Ya, WSU isn't going to fit.

UNI, in my opinion, would be the most logical team to move to the FBS because of past performance. I also think UNI would be a logical fit with the MAC simply because of geography.

In terms of Missouri State, we definitely would fit well with the Sun Belt simply because of geography, and the similarity in type and size with those institutions. I do have some problems with that not only because of the downgrade in basketball quality, though, but also because their soccer programs are worthless. I don't even mean they're bad - they're in a position where I don't really understand why they even offer soccer.

I think the better fit for Missouri State would also be the MAC because we're already an affiliate member, but they're not even looking to expand so it's pointless to hope for that.

However, I think that if something does happen, Missouri State moving is the most likely of the options given.
User avatar
Sir Sci
MVC starter
MVC starter
 
Posts: 250
Joined: April 7th, 2013, 7:45 pm

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby CaseyGarrisonforPrez » September 16th, 2014, 4:27 pm

jackwagon wrote:Coming from somebody who is a huge college football fan, Arkansas State is irrelevant to anyone that is not a fan of the team or who lives near there. I couldnt tell you one important game they or anyone in the sunbelt ever played. MVC basketball is more relevant and always has been.

That being said I am one of the people who believes that the valley would be better off with no football. D1-AA football is decent quality, but doesn't get the attention or money worth the funds it takes to run it. Our schools would be better off pouring that money into basketball.


I mean no offence, but I question how you can be a "huge college football fan" and yet not know more about the SBC. The Sun Belt has a primetime game each Tuesday night on the ESPN family of networks in October and November and I rarely miss a game. Arkansas State, ULM, and Louisiana Lafayette are fixtures. It isn't a Power Five league but it is very good football and played in pretty cool environments too.

I'd have no way of really knowing this but I would definitely suspect that the casual sports fan knows more about Sun Belt football than Valley basketball. Most people know about Larry Bird and that Wichita State has a good program but that is probably the extent of it.
CaseyGarrisonforPrez
All MVC
All MVC
 
Posts: 930
Joined: January 23rd, 2011, 11:51 am

Re: What's the next realignment domino to fall?

Postby CaseyGarrisonforPrez » September 16th, 2014, 4:36 pm

Sir Sci wrote:Without a football team, the only conferences even available to WSU to move to are the A-10 and the Big East. I find the A-10 incredibly unlikely simply because of geography, especially if SLU moves to the Big East someday. Quite simply, a team in Kansas isn't going to be in the Atlantic 10. The Big East is entirely private, and only one is not a Catholic school. Ya, WSU isn't going to fit.


There is some thought that the Mountain West is a possibility. I think there is a slivver of hope in that to be honest. Gonzaga could be in play too. As much as I dislike the Shocks I think they would be a better fit in the MWC. And Mark Few makes Gregg seem likeable in comparison if you can believe it. And less of a self promoter.

Your points on MSU are spot on as always my friend. I like soccer but it won't be the deciding factor in SBC vs. MAC of course. The SBC is more of a gateway to CUSA which in turn is a gateway to the AAC in time. That is my hope. I would see the MAC as a better home if we are buying a house in our new conference as opposed to simply renting however.
CaseyGarrisonforPrez
All MVC
All MVC
 
Posts: 930
Joined: January 23rd, 2011, 11:51 am

PreviousNext

Return to Missouri Valley Conference Basketball

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 65 guests