Who wins in St. Louis

[hot nuts]

UNI just doesn't strike me as being better than Loyola. I would have included SIU in that statement last week but now...sheesh. Actually Indiana State is really starting to play well(ish).

[BCPanther]

Laugh all you want about UNI, but I'm not counting them out. They play the entire season for one weekend in St. Louis. If anyone can pull it off it's Benny J.

True, they love to "help the conference out" by being horrible half the year only to steal a bid they didn't deserve.

I don't disagree with this. We were lost from December 15th until the middle of January and numbers wise aren't where we were last year, namely because we didn't beat an Iowa State or North Carolina this year.

The only 'silver lining' is that at least we play a decent schedule so that our RPI is in the 120s rather than the 220s. The schedule is still tough next year (@Carolina, Iowa State, Xavier, Atlantis, UNLV) but we should also be a bit more ready for the early stretch with way more coming back next year than we had this year.

[Stickboy46]

Laugh all you want about UNI, but I'm not counting them out. They play the entire season for one weekend in St. Louis. If anyone can pull it off it's Benny J.

True, they love to "help the conference out" by being horrible half the year only to steal a bid they didn't deserve.

You know what would have really helped the conference out, if UNI didn't suck so bad for a month and had a decent RPI or any ranking for that matter. That way, ISU/WSU would have had a shot at oh I don't know, a top 100 win in the league outside the split against each other....

I voted UNI because it just feels like they are getting hot at the right time. I hope I am wrong and Birds can finally get the job done in St. Louis, but I am not holding my breath. If you are WSU/ISU, that #1 seed is more important than it ever was in my eyes....on Saturday, who do you want to play....Northern Iowa or Loyola/Missouri State/SIU...pretty easy for me...

That's exactly what I was saying with your first paragraph. UNI fans like to parade around like they are helping the MVC out, when realistically they have only had 1 year in the last few years that actually helped anyone but UNI out (2015). The rest were all junk and hurt the MVC. If you aren't At-Large worthy, you aren't helping the MVC.

As far as the 2nd item. Are they really that "hot" right now? Sure they have won against the bottom 7 in the conference, but really hasn't been impressive.

In their current win streak they have scored:
55 Points against MSU (173rd AdjD via Kenpom)
49 VS SIU (193 AdjD)
65 VS ISUb (153 AdjD)
51 vs ISUr (12 AdjD)
71 VS Drake (270 AdjD)
61 vs Evansville (82 AdjD)
58 vs SIU (193 AdjD)
72 vs Loyola (165 AdjD)
79 vs drake (270 AdjD)

So in the games against Top 100 D they have scored, 51 and 61. With the exception of the two Drake games (270 AdjD), they haven't really been putting up much offense. Sure their Defense has gotten better, but if a team has a pulse on Defense, it's pretty easy to shut them down.

[UNIFanSince1983]

i'll give the edge to whoever doesn't play UNI on Saturday, assuming we get that far. If its a WSU / IlSU final on Sunday the team that had to play the grinder game on Saturday against UNI could have a hangover, especially if its the 2/3 game on Saturday leaving a team with a little shorter rest.

Delusion at its finest at Northern Iowa...there is a reason you are KenPom #135 and WSU is #16 and ISUr #45.

Oh and Loyola who just got beat by 17 at home yesterday is #107. But, by all means...believe what you want about how good UNI is.

So wait he really just says UNI likes to play a tough grind it out game which could hurt either ISUr or WSU in the semis and you think he is praising how good we are? Tell me what is more of a grind playing Loyola or UNI? I will listen if you think it is Loyola, but you will have to give more reasons than just KenPom overall rankings. He actually said he is giving the advantage to a team that doesn't have to play us in the semis. Just because the team will have to fight and claw for anything they need to do.

Personally I think we probably lose in either the 3/6 game or 4/5 game. I mean if we play MSU again in the 3/6 I think we could easily lose.

[Horn28Clem30]

More votes for UNI then Illinois State? That just shows the delusion of their fan base. They are far from even an average team. They won't beat either Wichita or Illinois State, let alone both of them.

[Khan4Cats]

Laugh all you want about UNI, but I'm not counting them out. They play the entire season for one weekend in St. Louis. If anyone can pull it off it's Benny J.

True, they love to "help the conference out" by being horrible half the year only to steal a bid they didn't deserve.

Yes, because we have done that how many times?

Last year, maybe. WSU still got an at-large, Evansville was 2nd place and left out of even the NIT, so I'm not sure who we stole from.
14-15? We were 27-3 prior to St. Louis and likely would have been an at-large considering we got a high seed.
09-10? We were 25-4 prior to St. Louis and regular season champs, almost certainly an at-large as well.
08-09? We were 20-10 prior but regular season champs also, and we were the lone bid. Did we steal from Creighton, the co-champs and #2 seed, I don't know.
Our only other auto-bid was 03-04 when we were the 2 seed in St. Louis, SIU got an at-large as the regular season champion, so I don't think we stole a bid from anyone in the conference.

[Stickboy46]

i'll give the edge to whoever doesn't play UNI on Saturday, assuming we get that far. If its a WSU / IlSU final on Sunday the team that had to play the grinder game on Saturday against UNI could have a hangover, especially if its the 2/3 game on Saturday leaving a team with a little shorter rest.

Delusion at its finest at Northern Iowa...there is a reason you are KenPom #135 and WSU is #16 and ISUr #45.

Oh and Loyola who just got beat by 17 at home yesterday is #107. But, by all means...believe what you want about how good UNI is.

but you will have to give more reasons than just KenPom overall rankings.

So ... he needs to give more feelings and general thoughts rather than identifiable facts?

[Khan4Cats]

That's exactly what I was saying with your first paragraph. UNI fans like to parade around like they are helping the MVC out, when realistically they have only had 1 year in the last few years that actually helped anyone but UNI out (2015). The rest were all junk and hurt the MVC. If you aren't At-Large worthy, you aren't helping the MVC.

As far as the 2nd item. Are they really that "hot" right now? Sure they have won against the bottom 7 in the conference, but really hasn't been impressive.

In their current win streak they have scored:
55 Points against MSU (173rd AdjD via Kenpom)
49 VS SIU (193 AdjD)
65 VS ISUb (153 AdjD)
51 vs ISUr (12 AdjD)
71 VS Drake (270 AdjD)
61 vs Evansville (82 AdjD)
58 vs SIU (193 AdjD)
72 vs Loyola (165 AdjD)
79 vs drake (270 AdjD)

So in the games against Top 100 D they have scored, 51 and 61. With the exception of the two Drake games (270 AdjD), they haven't really been putting up much offense. Sure their Defense has gotten better, but if a team has a pulse on Defense, it's pretty easy to shut them down.

Only 2015. Really. We haven't 'stolen' a bid from anyone in the Valley. Maybe from someone in a Power 5 conference with a .500 record, but certainly not from anyone in the Valley.

Could it happen this year? Maybe, I think if anyone other than WSU and ISU wins St. Louis, it probably costs one of those two, possibly both. That's probably why WSU and ISU fans are so defensive right now, they know they are on the edge and one slip could push them off.

[Stickboy46]

That's exactly what I was saying with your first paragraph. UNI fans like to parade around like they are helping the MVC out, when realistically they have only had 1 year in the last few years that actually helped anyone but UNI out (2015). The rest were all junk and hurt the MVC. If you aren't At-Large worthy, you aren't helping the MVC.

As far as the 2nd item. Are they really that "hot" right now? Sure they have won against the bottom 7 in the conference, but really hasn't been impressive.

In their current win streak they have scored:
55 Points against MSU (173rd AdjD via Kenpom)
49 VS SIU (193 AdjD)
65 VS ISUb (153 AdjD)
51 vs ISUr (12 AdjD)
71 VS Drake (270 AdjD)
61 vs Evansville (82 AdjD)
58 vs SIU (193 AdjD)
72 vs Loyola (165 AdjD)
79 vs drake (270 AdjD)

So in the games against Top 100 D they have scored, 51 and 61. With the exception of the two Drake games (270 AdjD), they haven't really been putting up much offense. Sure their Defense has gotten better, but if a team has a pulse on Defense, it's pretty easy to shut them down.

Only 2015. Really. We haven't 'stolen' a bid from anyone in the Valley. Maybe from someone in a Power 5 conference with a .500 record, but certainly not from anyone in the Valley.

Could it happen this year? Maybe, I think if anyone other than WSU and ISU wins St. Louis, it probably costs one of those two, possibly both. That's probably why WSU and ISU fans are so defensive right now, they know they are on the edge and one slip could push them off.

You just don't get it. The reason WSU/ISU are defensive (and WSU most of the recent year) is because they have to literally go 17-1 or 18-0 in order to get an at large. There are ZERO Quality wins outside of each other. So there is a minefield of 16 games that you can't slip up at all. So when fans of other teams (like UNI) go parading around like they are "helping" the Valley, when they provide nothing more than a bad loss to a team with a chance at an at large, it gets annoying. I'd love for UNI to be actually good, not Valley good, but actually good. Something that is pushing the needle to be a quality win, or an at large. They haven't consistently gotten there yet. ISU did this year.

[Khan4Cats]

That's exactly what I was saying with your first paragraph. UNI fans like to parade around like they are helping the MVC out, when realistically they have only had 1 year in the last few years that actually helped anyone but UNI out (2015). The rest were all junk and hurt the MVC. If you aren't At-Large worthy, you aren't helping the MVC.

As far as the 2nd item. Are they really that "hot" right now? Sure they have won against the bottom 7 in the conference, but really hasn't been impressive.

In their current win streak they have scored:
55 Points against MSU (173rd AdjD via Kenpom)
49 VS SIU (193 AdjD)
65 VS ISUb (153 AdjD)
51 vs ISUr (12 AdjD)
71 VS Drake (270 AdjD)
61 vs Evansville (82 AdjD)
58 vs SIU (193 AdjD)
72 vs Loyola (165 AdjD)
79 vs drake (270 AdjD)

So in the games against Top 100 D they have scored, 51 and 61. With the exception of the two Drake games (270 AdjD), they haven't really been putting up much offense. Sure their Defense has gotten better, but if a team has a pulse on Defense, it's pretty easy to shut them down.

Only 2015. Really. We haven't 'stolen' a bid from anyone in the Valley. Maybe from someone in a Power 5 conference with a .500 record, but certainly not from anyone in the Valley.

Could it happen this year? Maybe, I think if anyone other than WSU and ISU wins St. Louis, it probably costs one of those two, possibly both. That's probably why WSU and ISU fans are so defensive right now, they know they are on the edge and one slip could push them off.

You just don't get it. The reason WSU/ISU are defensive (and WSU most of the recent year) is because they have to literally go 17-1 or 18-0 in order to get an at large. There are ZERO Quality wins outside of each other. So there is a minefield of 16 games that you can't slip up at all. So when fans of other teams (like UNI) go parading around like they are "helping" the Valley, when they provide nothing more than a bad loss to a team with a chance at an at large, it gets annoying. I'd love for UNI to be actually good, not Valley good, but actually good. Something that is pushing the needle to be a quality win, or an at large. They haven't consistently gotten there yet. ISU did this year.

No, I get it just fine. Your two teams, knowing that they are not likely to get any help in conference, went out and played okay but not great in the non-conference and did nothing that you know would actually help you in the non-conference, leaving yourself a very narrow window of opportunity to earn an at-large by winning out in conference. You would have loved for UNI to beat North Carolina or Evansville to beat Louisville to help YOU out but not for their own purposes. You always talk of having to do it yourselves, then do it, beat Michigan State, beat Oklahoma State, beat, well I don't see anyone on the Redbirds schedule that would jump out as a signature win, so anyways maybe they really didn't give themselves that much of a shot at an at-large after all. You both still have full control of whether you make the NCAA's or not. Leaving that to a committee that continually has shown a favoritism to the power schools with a moving list of criteria is foolish.