Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Discuss the MVC hoops season here.

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby Veritas » April 19th, 2017, 9:27 am

unipanther99 wrote:


Why should she be supportive of a school wanting to use her conference as a jumping point to another conference? Her job is to maintain a stable, high-quality FCS conference. Not an incubator for schools with FBS aspirations. A school who would then leave the flagship all-sport conference as well.

There are reasons to criticize Patty, but I don't think this comment is one of those reasons.


You are misleading. You didn't include the comment from AsianSensation to which I replied.

If the MVC and MVFC are ultimately the same, her comment expedited the departure of WSU. If she would have responded with a positive remarks on the inclusion of WSU football, who knows what could have happened 3-5-10 years from now. However, her negative remarks were the final nail in the coffin.
Are you better now as a conference?
Veritas
MVC Role Player
MVC Role Player
 
Posts: 111
Joined: August 9th, 2010, 6:27 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Sponsor

Sponsor
 

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby unipanther99 » April 19th, 2017, 9:33 am

Veritas wrote:
You are misleading. You didn't include the comment from AsianSensation to which I replied.

If the MVC and MVFC are ultimately the same, her comment expedited the departure of WSU. If she would have responded with a positive remarks on the inclusion of WSU football, who knows what could have happened 3-5-10 years from now. However, her negative remarks were the final nail in the coffin.
Are you better now as a conference?


Are you suggesting WSU would have said no to the AAC if Patty Viverito had been nicer to WSU about football?
User avatar
unipanther99
MVCfans.com
MVCfans.com
 
Posts: 1490
Joined: August 4th, 2010, 3:18 pm
Location: Iowa City

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby TheAsianSensation » April 19th, 2017, 9:40 am

uniftw wrote:
I think most/all of us on this site - or Valley Talk back in the day - saw what was happening with the Big East, and then what happened with the Big East, and knew the day was coming for us but hoped the league would do something to ensure that it didn't. Well, the league didn't do anything. The "best" move right now is for the MVC to absorb the MVFC. Make it a conference sponsored sport. It protects the current MVFC/MVC schools. Make a promise to YSU that they will always have a home as an affiliate member. That keeps the league at 7 if the Summit wants to do their own thing at some point. The ensured safety of the football schools is what is needed. Once that is ensured the mission of the MVC can be made as a basketball run league that sponsors football at the FCS level. If the Summit teams don't like it then they can form their 3 time zone monster league and try to attain a bid or they can deal with the fact they have a stable home for football.


Pretty good breakdown of the various options (that I deleted in this quote for space considerations). I'm not as big a fan of having the MVC absorb the MVCF because of a couple lingering questions:
1) Would NDSU go for it? They obviously are big dog in the MVCF, but being an affiliate member of a conference in one sport is usually not preferred for a big dog
2) It brings slightly more complicated expansion decisions. For example, Murray wouldn't be able to leave their football in the OVC if they join us, while under the current format, I believe they'd be allowed to. The Dakota schools would have a louder voice in expansion decisions for basketball than they currently do

I do wonder if the status of MVCF as a relatively big dog in FCS makes things tricky. Anything that gives the Dakotas a louder voice in the expansion discussion is risky, IMO.
http://bracketball.blogspot.com/ A national version of the world-famous TAS Bracketology. Spread the word
TheAsianSensation
MVCfans.com
MVCfans.com
 
Posts: 1064
Joined: April 6th, 2012, 7:23 am

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 19th, 2017, 10:18 am

TheAsianSensation wrote:
Pretty good breakdown of the various options (that I deleted in this quote for space considerations). I'm not as big a fan of having the MVC absorb the MVCF because of a couple lingering questions:
1) Would NDSU go for it? They obviously are big dog in the MVCF, but being an affiliate member of a conference in one sport is usually not preferred for a big dog
2) It brings slightly more complicated expansion decisions. For example, Murray wouldn't be able to leave their football in the OVC if they join us, while under the current format, I believe they'd be allowed to. The Dakota schools would have a louder voice in expansion decisions for basketball than they currently do

I do wonder if the status of MVCF as a relatively big dog in FCS makes things tricky. Anything that gives the Dakotas a louder voice in the expansion discussion is risky, IMO.

1. Doesn't matter if NDSU would go for it. The MVC (I'm going to include YSU as part of the MVC schools from now on in this post) out number Summit schools. NDSU has zero other options right now - or any time soon. They can be the big dog all they want, DGAF. They can be an affiliate MVFC member, like all schools, or be an affiliate in the MVC. Litearlly nothing changes for them in terms of how they are set up. They might feel like someone is out to get them, but that's their own issue.

Remember, it's not the MVC starting football and inviting all of these schools. It would be the MVFC ceding power to the MVC. There is precedent for that before - see the CAA/Yankee/A10 history. All that would change is that Patty would work for the MVC in the football capacity - not the MVFC. Or Patty gives control to Doug Elgin (scary as well) and keeps control of the PFL.

2. It doesn't really complicate expansion decisions. The MVC wouldn't be taking over control this year anyway (in this hypothetical). Murray State is going to have to stay a member of the OVC, no matter what, this year. It's impossible for both conferences to make it work this late. MVFC schedules are set through 2019, which is why UND isn't joining until 2020. MVC takes over control of the MVFC doesn't change any of that, it just changes the "who is in control". Maybe the name goes from MVFC to just MVC. If the OVC really throws a fit then the conference redoes 2018 and 2019s schedules. It would suck, but so be it.

It's clearly not as simple as I laid out, but message boards are for over simplifying. It could work. The biggest thing, as you said, is keeping the Summit schools from being able to take control. If they don't like it and want to try to start their own, so be it. I guess it'll suck to lose 2 quality programs in NDSU and SDSDU and then a long time rival like WIU, but I'd rather focus on the MVC being healthy and competitive long term than my football league. I think that's the story you'd hear from UNI, ISUr, ISUb, SIU and probably even MSU.

Protecting those 5, plus Murray State should they join, should be priority #1 after adding a quality team or two for depth. If that means folding the football league into the all sports conference, it should be considered. Again, the Summit teams don't have enough football members to start their own conference, and their isn't much precedent for the NCAA to allow them to start a new league and get an automtic bid to the playoffs simply because their league office changed hands, but nothing on the day to day side of it. Even if they allowed it they are going to have to create a 13-14 team all sports conference stretching from Indiana to Fargo to Oklahoma to both sides of Utah to do it. A 13-14 team 1 big league isn't a good idea. NCAA money gets spread real thin real quick in that. Barely enough to offset travel.
uniftw
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: January 20th, 2011, 9:01 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby RacerJoeD » April 19th, 2017, 10:54 am

As long as it doesn't interfere with the scheduled games against FBS schools, I think Murray's state hold be willing to go Independent as part of a transition to MVFC.
RacerJoeD
MVC Role Player
MVC Role Player
 
Posts: 142
Joined: April 13th, 2017, 9:13 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby NDB » April 19th, 2017, 11:12 am

The MVC and MVFC are not ultimately the same.

They are independent organizations. The MVFC is not subservient to the MVC in any way shape or form.

The idea that MVC members of the MVFC are going to dictate to non-MVC members how the MVFC is going to be run is ridiculous.

The MVC has its own mess that it needs to take care of. Football is a part of that. I expect that non-MVC members are open to helping the MVC stabilize and be successful, as it helps the MVFC. They are not going to bend over backwards or take a hit if it only helps the MVC, especially when it seems the MVC has no clue what it is or wants to be.
NDB
MVC Walk On
MVC Walk On
 
Posts: 9
Joined: August 18th, 2010, 8:18 am

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 19th, 2017, 11:14 am

RacerJoeD wrote:As long as it doesn't interfere with the scheduled games against FBS schools, I think Murray's state hold be willing to go Independent as part of a transition to MVFC.

As long as Murray continues to meet the scholarship requirement to be a counter, FBS games won't be affected.

I can't imagine the OVC doesn't have their conference schedule done a few years out. Everyone does. I would think, outside of an act of extreme spit, they wouldn't allow them to continue as an affiliate in the OVC. The recent precedent is set to allow it - UND is staying in the Big Sky for 2 years after leaving it.
uniftw
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: January 20th, 2011, 9:01 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 19th, 2017, 11:17 am

NDB wrote:The MVC and MVFC are not ultimately the same.

They are independent organizations. The MVFC is not subservient to the MVC in any way shape or form.

The idea that MVC members of the MVFC are going to dictate to non-MVC members how the MVFC is going to be run is ridiculous.

The MVC has its own mess that it needs to take care of. Football is a part of that. I expect that non-MVC members are open to helping the MVC stabilize and be successful, as it helps the MVFC. They are not going to bend over backwards or take a hit if it only helps the MVC, especially when it seems the MVC has no clue what it is or wants to be.

That's the thing - no one is dictating anything to Summit schools.

Yes, the MVC and MVFC are separate. The MVC taking control of football from the MVC is entirely possible if it helps stabilize the threat of Summit schools breaking off.

Nothing would change for anyone in the MVFC. Scheduling, official scheduling (unfortunately), etc... all stays exactly the same. It is simply run by the MVC not the independent MVFC.

There is no hit, other than perceived, for anyone in the Summit if the MVC takes control. Then again, we all know how quickly NDSU, and their fans, are at feeling disrespected and slighted by absolutely nothing.
uniftw
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: January 20th, 2011, 9:01 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby NDB » April 19th, 2017, 11:26 am

The MVC has the same number of members in the MVFC as the Summit.

What NDSU thinks does matter, as does every other institution in the MVFC.

I see no advantage to any MVFC institution in that organization becoming part of the MVC.


--Also think it's funny that NDSU is the bad partner, when it's a UNI fan who says they will take their lumps and like it!
NDB
MVC Walk On
MVC Walk On
 
Posts: 9
Joined: August 18th, 2010, 8:18 am

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 19th, 2017, 12:34 pm

NDB wrote:The MVC has the same number of members in the MVFC as the Summit.

What NDSU thinks does matter, as does every other institution in the MVFC.

I see no advantage to any MVFC institution in that organization becoming part of the MVC.


--Also think it's funny that NDSU is the bad partner, when it's a UNI fan who says they will take their lumps and like it!

YSU isn't going to side with the Summit teams. It's why the MVC has the strength over the Summit teams.

YSU was in the league for a decade before NDSU and SDSU showed up. YSU and the MVC schools have a very good relationship. Barring a CAA/MAC invite YSU knows the MVFC is it's best home and will protect it, and the fellow MVC schools.
uniftw
MVC Hall Of Famer
MVC Hall Of Famer
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: January 20th, 2011, 9:01 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby VU2014 » April 19th, 2017, 12:34 pm

The MVC and MVFC are two separate entities. No the MVC and MVFC will NOT experiencing realignment.

Back to the Non-Football Conference talk folks. Give it a rest.
VU2014
MVC Bench Warmer
MVC Bench Warmer
 
Posts: 59
Joined: March 19th, 2017, 8:53 pm

Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby NDB » April 19th, 2017, 1:03 pm

This.
NDB
MVC Walk On
MVC Walk On
 
Posts: 9
Joined: August 18th, 2010, 8:18 am

PreviousNext

Return to Missouri Valley Conference Basketball

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests