Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby BirdsEyeView » April 21st, 2017, 2:15 pm

Cdizzle wrote:
BirdsEyeView wrote:No. You hit home runs on hires and have a HUGE HUGE HUGE endowment, specifically coming from two brothers.

You know very, very little about this situation. Like, practically zero. Probably best you quit running it out there.

BirdsEyeView wrote:If I were in charge of this conference and WSU said they were trying to bring Football in, only with the intent to leverage it for a bigger conference, I would have said F U to them too.

Why cater to a school with a foot out the door already?

Then you would be as inept as the current league leadership. Clearly it is working out well for them. Sometimes, it is best to simply say nothing at all.


Per your first comment...

I would say enlighten me, but I really don't care.
Your donors have much deeper pockets than many mid-major public schools and those deep pockets can be reached into when needed to keep people around. Sort of like an emergency fund.

Per your second comment...

So, if you are the boss of a company (conference) that is thriving at its level. You bring on a new hire who tells you that initially things might get worse (brand new Football program joining the top rated FCS conference in the country) and will have to change the dynamic of the workplace (schedules, travel plans, etc. etc.) and THEN tells you "we are only planning to be around a few years".....you would still hire this person???

Come on.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby Cdizzle » April 21st, 2017, 2:31 pm

BirdsEyeView wrote:
Per your first comment...

I would say enlighten me, but I really don't care.

"Being wrong doesn't bother me. I like my narrative."

Continuation of narrative:
"Your donors have much deeper pockets than many mid-major public schools and those deep pockets can be reached into when needed to keep people around. Sort of like an emergency fund."

BirdsEyeView wrote:Per your second comment...

So, if you are the boss of a company (conference) that is thriving at its level. You bring on a new hire who tells you that initially things might get worse (brand new Football program joining the top rated FCS conference in the country) and will have to change the dynamic of the workplace (schedules, travel plans, etc. etc.) and THEN tells you "we are only planning to be around a few years".....you would still hire this person???

Come on.

You missed my point on this part. I'm not saying that MVCF should have bending over backwards to roll out the welcome mat for WSU football if WSU was vocal about only having a program there short-term. I am saying there is another, much better option: Don't say anything. Using your example, executives of successful companies don't run around saying "we didn't hire this guy because XYZ," regardless of whether their reasons were correct or not.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby BirdsEyeView » April 21st, 2017, 2:45 pm

Cdizzle wrote:
BirdsEyeView wrote:
Per your first comment...

I would say enlighten me, but I really don't care.

"Being wrong doesn't bother me. I like my narrative."

Continuation of narrative:
"Your donors have much deeper pockets than many mid-major public schools and those deep pockets can be reached into when needed to keep people around. Sort of like an emergency fund."

BirdsEyeView wrote:Per your second comment...

So, if you are the boss of a company (conference) that is thriving at its level. You bring on a new hire who tells you that initially things might get worse (brand new Football program joining the top rated FCS conference in the country) and will have to change the dynamic of the workplace (schedules, travel plans, etc. etc.) and THEN tells you "we are only planning to be around a few years".....you would still hire this person???

Come on.

You missed my point on this part. I'm not saying that MVCF should have bending over backwards to roll out the welcome mat for WSU football if WSU was vocal about only having a program there short-term. I am saying there is another, much better option: Don't say anything. Using your example, executives of successful companies don't run around saying "we didn't hire this guy because XYZ," regardless of whether their reasons were correct or not.


First part...
I am not wrong with the first part. They have a billionaire emergency fund they can dip into when needed.

From an article:
"After an initial offer early in the week, Wichita State needed to get closer to Alabama’s offer of around $4.2 million a year for six years. The community responded. Business leaders and big boosters, with Charles Koch of Koch Industries playing a lead role, organized, donated and lobbied to raise Marshall’s salary from its current base of $1.85 million."

Koch playing a lead role in. I guess I don't understand why you are so defensive that you have big boosters, two of which have $50 billion+ in their accounts. It's a major competitive advantage that many MVC schools can't match. They can fork over money when needed....like when Alabama forced your hand. Something most mid-majors can't do.

Second part...

I never said I would PUBLICLY say F U to them. That was an exaggeration anyways, but I would tell them no way if that is your short-term goal.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 21st, 2017, 2:46 pm

Cdizzle wrote:Actually this brings up an interesting point. Is there something in the conference bylaws that removes voting rights from an institution once they have given written notice to leave the league? Even if they are still in said league? I've seen the stuff about losing NCAA shares upon exit and so on. WSU is still a member of the MVC until July. Clearly the league has no need for WSU's input and WSU has no desire to provide said input or interfere with any of the league's proceedings henceforth. Obviously the same scenario occurred with Creighton a few years ago, but I don't recall it being mentioned then either.

I know when it came to voting for DBU for baseball UNI voted the way the majority did and it didn't affect the outcome of the vote - or UNI. If it was a close vote UNI would have abstained to not influence the outcome since they weren't affected. Then again - UNI wasn't leaving the conference.

I can't imagine WSU voting against anyone coming it. I can't imagine them voting at all. Likely abstaining or voting "for" because that's what will happen anyway

I also wouldn't be shocked if there is a provision hidden somewhere that states once you "agree to leave" the conference you lose voting power.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby Cdizzle » April 21st, 2017, 3:12 pm

BirdsEyeView wrote:
First part...
I am not wrong with the first part. They have a billionaire emergency fund they can dip into when needed.

From an article:
"After an initial offer early in the week, Wichita State needed to get closer to Alabama’s offer of around $4.2 million a year for six years. The community responded. Business leaders and big boosters, with Charles Koch of Koch Industries playing a lead role, organized, donated and lobbied to raise Marshall’s salary from its current base of $1.85 million."

Koch playing a lead role in. I guess I don't understand why you are so defensive that you have big boosters, two of which have $50 billion+ in their accounts. It's a major competitive advantage that many MVC schools can't match. They can fork over money when needed....like when Alabama forced your hand. Something most mid-majors can't do.

Because it is factually incorrect.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby Snaggletooth » April 21st, 2017, 3:13 pm

uniftw wrote:
Cdizzle wrote:
I know when it came to voting for DBU for baseball UNI voted the way the majority did and it didn't affect the outcome of the vote - or UNI. If it was a close vote UNI would have abstained to not influence the outcome since they weren't affected. Then again - UNI wasn't leaving the conference.

.


First time the DBU vote came up it failed. I don't know how UNI voted, but I do remember that Drake voted no (among some other schools). The second time they voted Drake abstained from voting.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby Cdizzle » April 21st, 2017, 3:16 pm

uniftw wrote:
Cdizzle wrote:Actually this brings up an interesting point. Is there something in the conference bylaws that removes voting rights from an institution once they have given written notice to leave the league? Even if they are still in said league? I've seen the stuff about losing NCAA shares upon exit and so on. WSU is still a member of the MVC until July. Clearly the league has no need for WSU's input and WSU has no desire to provide said input or interfere with any of the league's proceedings henceforth. Obviously the same scenario occurred with Creighton a few years ago, but I don't recall it being mentioned then either.

I know when it came to voting for DBU for baseball UNI voted the way the majority did and it didn't affect the outcome of the vote - or UNI. If it was a close vote UNI would have abstained to not influence the outcome since they weren't affected. Then again - UNI wasn't leaving the conference.

I can't imagine WSU voting against anyone coming it. I can't imagine them voting at all. Likely abstaining or voting "for" because that's what will happen anyway

I also wouldn't be shocked if there is a provision hidden somewhere that states once you "agree to leave" the conference you lose voting power.

Yeah. I'm curious if there is a provision. Obviously I assume WSU would just abstain or vote with the majority. But that could make things interesting in certain instances where there is a public/private split over a prospective member and a certain number of votes are needed. I'm sure it's all written down somewhere, I just haven't found it, and it is an interesting situation to me.

Anyway. Murray and Valpo are very good candidates. Kudos to the MVC if they can make that happen this time around.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby BirdsEyeView » April 21st, 2017, 3:26 pm

Cdizzle wrote:
BirdsEyeView wrote:
First part...
I am not wrong with the first part. They have a billionaire emergency fund they can dip into when needed.

From an article:
"After an initial offer early in the week, Wichita State needed to get closer to Alabama’s offer of around $4.2 million a year for six years. The community responded. Business leaders and big boosters, with Charles Koch of Koch Industries playing a lead role, organized, donated and lobbied to raise Marshall’s salary from its current base of $1.85 million."

Koch playing a lead role in. I guess I don't understand why you are so defensive that you have big boosters, two of which have $50 billion+ in their accounts. It's a major competitive advantage that many MVC schools can't match. They can fork over money when needed....like when Alabama forced your hand. Something most mid-majors can't do.

Because it is factually incorrect.


How so? I'm now intrigued and killing time at the end of my work day.
Here is my thought process so you have the right context...
I am not saying on an annual giving basis. I am saying an "emergency fund" for money required to keep coaches around when a competing offer comes in. Your boosters can increase their giving when needed.

It's like me and you leveraging an offer to increase our salaries from our current job. They have the funds, it just needs to have the demand for them to access those funds to pay you off.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby uniftw » April 21st, 2017, 3:33 pm

Snaggletooth wrote:
uniftw wrote:
Cdizzle wrote:
I know when it came to voting for DBU for baseball UNI voted the way the majority did and it didn't affect the outcome of the vote - or UNI. If it was a close vote UNI would have abstained to not influence the outcome since they weren't affected. Then again - UNI wasn't leaving the conference.

.


First time the DBU vote came up it failed. I don't know how UNI voted, but I do remember that Drake voted no (among some other schools). The second time they voted Drake abstained from voting.

I'm pretty sure UNI voted yes twice or yes once and abstain once.

I know the second time they were a yes vote. The first time I think was an abstain, and the reason they went yes the second time was to try to help the baseball schools get them in.
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Re: Sounds like Wichita St to the AAC... Who gets an Invite?

Postby TheAsianSensation » April 21st, 2017, 5:14 pm

An idle thought that's relevant to the Dakotas.

Let's assume Murray and Valpo are 10 and 11, and let's say Omaha is #12. Unlikely, but possible.

Summit loses Omaha...and the Horizon probably raids the Summit to replace Valpo (either IUPUI or IPFW. Heck, maybe both).

Then the Summit is down to:
the 4 Dakotas
Oral Bob
Denver
WIU

That's danger zone territory.

In an extreme case, the Horizon takes both Indiana schools, and WIU decides to bail to a conference like the OVC. Oral Bob was in the Southland before, maybe they bail if membership dwindles. Denver can easily bail to the WAC. There is a chain reaction out there which does result in the end of the Summit if things break the wrong way. It does require a combination of Omaha + Horizon League teams, but it's out there.
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