If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Discuss the MVC hoops season here.

Choose 2 (you may change your vote later)

Murray State
67
46%
Oral Roberts
13
9%
Northern Kentucky
27
18%
North Dakota State
8
5%
South Dakota State
6
4%
South Dakota
4
3%
Other (please comment)
21
14%
 
Total votes : 146

Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby VUGrad1314 » December 2nd, 2017, 9:38 pm

glm38 wrote:
bleach wrote:In my opinion, 12 is too many. What is the benefit of adding teams that don't raise the perceived level of the conference? The AAC adding WSU raises the level of the AAC. Adding Northern Kentucky (or insert any other team available) doesn't add name recognition, facilities, history, or anything I can think of.


I agree. And if we aren't adding teams that raise the level of the Valley and we only get one team in the ncaa tourney then the odds of getting in are decreased for each team you add. And the tournament shares would be smaller too.


How exactly does adding schools that either are or have the potential to be top 100 programs like the ones frequently mentioned in this thread not boost the profile of the conference?
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby Jsnhbe1Birds » December 3rd, 2017, 3:27 am

"the MVC shouldn't add teams unless it raises the conference".

News flash. The MVC isn't getting Duke or anyone close. Everyone seems to love Murray State but you can't make me believe they raise the level of the MVC. Nobody mentioned does. That's why you gobble up as many good teams as possible for strength in numbers.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby bleach » December 3rd, 2017, 1:48 pm

VUGrad1314 wrote:Their facilities are actually pretty nice and they're investing heavily in athletics. Their D2 history is really strong. They made the NCAA Tournament in their first year of eligibility and gave Kentucky everything it could handle. It makes the MVC the preeminent mid major league in the state of Kentucky and gets the MVC into the Cincinnati market.


What does their arena hold?
Preeminent mid major league? Oxymoron?
I bet that Cincinnati market will generate a lot of revenue. How about taking the leagues 1 NCAA share and split it 12 ways instead of 10.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby Jsnhbe1Birds » December 3rd, 2017, 2:09 pm

bleach wrote:
VUGrad1314 wrote:Their facilities are actually pretty nice and they're investing heavily in athletics. Their D2 history is really strong. They made the NCAA Tournament in their first year of eligibility and gave Kentucky everything it could handle. It makes the MVC the preeminent mid major league in the state of Kentucky and gets the MVC into the Cincinnati market.


What does their arena hold?
Preeminent mid major league? Oxymoron?
I bet that Cincinnati market will generate a lot of revenue. How about taking the leagues 1 NCAA share and split it 12 ways instead of 10.


brand new 9,400 beautiful arena http://www.gbbn.com/pub/photos/xl/QbauBYsBwaYyaC.jpg
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby bleach » December 3rd, 2017, 2:23 pm

Jsnhbe1Birds wrote:
bleach wrote:
brand new 9,400 beautiful arena http://www.gbbn.com/pub/photos/xl/QbauBYsBwaYyaC.jpg


Great. Now let them earn a spot rather than assuming they will be great.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby VUGrad1314 » December 3rd, 2017, 2:51 pm

Their arena hold 9400 and is within 5 hours drive of every MVC school except Drake UNI and Missouri State. Their attendance numbers will be strong most nights in conference especially in the MVC. Their KenPom rating is 92 which would place them 5th in that metric in the MVC right now just behind preseason darling Loyola and ahead of all other popularly mentioned additions including Belmont Murray State and SLU. They would go a long way toward making the MVC a multi-bid league again. I don't buy the premise that this is a one-bid league going forward and even if it is we should be working on jamming the NIT field full of MVC members and raising our conference profile that way.

Would a HL regular season title 20+ wins and a second consecutive trip to the NCAA tournament (in their second year of eligibility mind you) be enough to convince you?
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby IllinoisState » December 3rd, 2017, 4:33 pm

VUGrad1314 wrote:Their arena hold 9400 and is within 5 hours drive of every MVC school except Drake UNI and Missouri State. Their attendance numbers will be strong most nights in conference especially in the MVC. Their KenPom rating is 92 which would place them 5th in that metric in the MVC right now just behind preseason darling Loyola and ahead of all other popularly mentioned additions including Belmont Murray State and SLU. They would go a long way toward making the MVC a multi-bid league again. I don't buy the premise that this is a one-bid league going forward and even if it is we should be working on jamming the NIT field full of MVC members and raising our conference profile that way.

Would a HL regular season title 20+ wins and a second consecutive trip to the NCAA tournament (in their second year of eligibility mind you) be enough to convince you?


Me personally, no. Valpo was brought in due to location and sustained success. Northern Kentucky has the location and short term success, but can it be sustained? I'd like to see a few more years and add two more if it makes sense.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby VUGrad1314 » December 3rd, 2017, 4:45 pm

The problem is, of course, with realignment set to heat up in a big way, I don't think we have time to wait if we want to keep up with other conferences and get the teams we want.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby title » December 4th, 2017, 8:38 am

VUGrad1314 wrote:The problem is, of course, with realignment set to heat up in a big way, I don't think we have time to wait if we want to keep up with other conferences and get the teams we want.


There's not going to be much in the way of realignment in the foreseeable future. The high major conferences are where realignment comes from because they can just take anyone from below forcing them to reshuffle. The high major conferences are all at equilibrium right now, though, and none are looking to do anything.

The only vague possibility floating out there is the state of Connecticut reducing UConn funding. UConn's moribund football program is the only thing keeping the school out of the Big East. The Big East would stop at 11 and a 20-game schedule but the AAC could try the quantity over quality thing and throw some stuff against the wall.

https://ctmirror.org/2017/09/20/state-e ... t-dispute/
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby RacerJoeD » December 4th, 2017, 10:12 am

Conference realignment is still in flux. The WAC looks fragile as CSUB is leaving, following rumors that UMKC would be looking to leave the WAC and return to the Summit. If both were to leave, even with the addition of Cal Baptist (as is planned) they would be at seven teams. From what I have heard reported, that is the bare minimum for Division 1 autobids. If a team were to leave, the WAC would be in mortal danger. there is a reason why I have called them the "Sick Man of Division 1".

Conference realignment is also taking place in the east. Liberty is leaving the Big South and going FBS independent. To fill that void, the Big South has added Hampton from the MEAC, USC Upstate from the A Sun, and Campbell (football from Pioneer league).

By taking USC Upstate, they have pushed the A Sun to seven members. The A Sun will add North Alabama from D2, but that pairing looks short lived, as UNA is primarily a football school and the A Sun doesn't offer football.

IUPUI has recently moved from the Summit to the Horizon to fill in the spot left by Valpo who left to fill the spot left by WSU.

So to say that there isn't much realignment in the foreseeable future is probably not accurate. In fact, it hasn't really ever stopped.
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby RacerJoeD » December 4th, 2017, 10:15 am

I will say this though. It looks as though any conference that wants a seat at the table for the next 20 years or so will need to be settled before 2023.

http://www.espn.com/college-football/st ... -shuffling
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Re: If we go to 12 who do you want (choose 2) poll?

Postby BEARZ77 » December 4th, 2017, 11:29 am

It amazes me that anybody at our level places much value or has hopes for significant movement based on conference realignment anymore. I thought yesterday was a defining moment that has been downplayed/overlooked in terms of a statement about the true direction of D-1 major sports. There was much debate about the 4th FBS playoff spot and who it should be, given the three major contestants were all pretty flawed. That Alabama, a team that didn't win it's division, didn't win a conference Championship game, and had no top 15 wins was chosen seems to have been accepted readily. Why this is a portent of the future is that you have an undefeated UCF team that won a top 6 conference title, won a conference championship game and was never in the conversation. They can call all the teams outside the Big 5 whatever they want, but it's clear they're not really D-1 FBS level because they have no way and never will have a way to play for the national Championship no matter what. This year was the perfect chance to see what would happen, and there it was.

I don't think it will be too far in the future when the NCAA does away with automatic qualifiers in basketball so that they no longer have to auto include teams from the lower 20+ conferences to the NCAA Tourney. A few mids might get an invite, but just as we see in football, the club will have exclusivity rules that make it very difficult. They don't really mind the other sports and basically need mids for things like baseball and most women's sports, but in the only two sports where the money is huge, they want it all and will get what they want.

The Big East in basketball and probably a few fringe teams in other conferences, Gonzaga etc, will find ways into the selection process probably by a last realignment move that defines the haves and have nots, but if you aren't someone who is exclusively basketball like Big East schools, Gonzaga, WSU and a few others, you ain't gotta chance. JMO
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