Cdizzle wrote:Your conclusion assumes that bad and mediocre teams don't ever beat good and great teams. And that's a terrible assumption. Bad and mediocre teams beat good and even great teams. It happens all the time. One bad team doesn't do it a lot in one season, but lots of bad teams beat lots of good teams in aggregate.
No, really that's not it at all. I think this is where we're going to have to agree to disagree which I'm fine with because you're abandoning the original statement. An ISU poster said we've had some "good" teams, but not "good enough" to get over the hump of the MVC finals. I backed that statement with years where we made the final beating a few really good Valley teams in the semifinal, with teams that were good themselves. I think you've projected the image of the Valley today (I agree... terrible) backwards to throughout it's history. We've had some pretty good upper tiers of Valley schools, and it's rare a "bad" team reaches the finals.
Yes, bad and mediocre teams beat good and great teams all the time, but in context of the discussion we were having, the Redbird posters point is very valid.
Cdizzle wrote:I seem to have done a lot of 'backtracking' I don't remember. I suppose you also forgot to read the parts where I tried very hard to maintain thread civility and not direct my comments specifically at any given team.
Nope, didn't forget at all. This is why I enjoy the back and forth with you. It really didn't matter which team you were talking about, in my examples I was just showing that throughout the last 10 years there were games in the semifinals where very good teams were beaten. It's difficult to find a final where there aren't two good Valley teams there. But yes, a sliding scale is being used because good is such a subjective word.
Cdizzle wrote:If you would really like to get into the specifics of relevance, mediocre/good/great both at the conference and national level, specific to the 2 teams you want to talk about, I'm game. But you're going to start not having any fun very quickly.
Really? Yeah man, let's take a look at how the 2 teams have faired nationally because that has SO much relevance to this conversation it's not even funny. Typical Shocker response right there.